Thoughts on being a Christian Bodybuilder...is the lifestyle sinful?

[MuscleAddiction]

Pretty much sums up my reoccurring question that is in my head on a daily basis. So in my life, recent occurrences have turned me back into faith and Christianity, daily bible reading as well as bible study, going to church weekly, volunteering in the youth ministry (a program that my little girl is involved in weekly), and prayer. Our family was baptized last year together, and we have accepted Jesus Christ as our lord and savior...but now this has brought some questions to my mind in regards to my bodybuilding competition lifestyle...obviously some of the aspects you can all figure out without me saying would they be considered sinful? Big Hoss and I have had some PM's recently about this and with his suggestion...a good one at that...I had asked Knights to put up this forum to hopefully bring forward some other Christian brotherhood here so we can have some insight and discussions about this. Thanks Hoss for reaching out to me, and thank you Knights for putting up this forum!!!

[Orange24]

It's not hurting anyone, not sinning against your own body and is relatively rooted in healthy life style. Legality issues are tough for me to chime in on. This countries laws are so beyond me. I just don't know how we got here with the abundance of control. But I know what you mean. Hard to truly tell.

[Vicious 13]

It's absolutely a sin. After going to a Christian highschool and being a big stoner and fully tattoed I've gone over this a lot. I'm not the type of Christian that would judge one for their choices as I believe everyone's relationship w God is different but lots of Christians will disagree w me. We are altering our god given genetics w science. Almost playing god in a way. Many of us myself included do it for looks what it called being vain?


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[xdude]

well I guess this whole subject should start wiith which version of Christianity..Catholic, priotestian, presbierian medthodist ,baptsit ..heck even mormans are christians .. then we can gett to what bible , king james, latin, guettenberg and as I said Churh of latter day saints ...
there are just too many permutations in what is christianity ..
I think one of the basic is not to be judgemental .. so I lean toward not commenting on which version of christianity... I am not sure who is right and I lean toward WWJCD ..and that is not Jay Cutler...:D
so in this mordern age would Jesus workout.... probably... he not know to be lazy and healthy seems to me something he would do granted when you can turn water into wine , then why not a protien shake

BB I can not picture that.... after all I can not picture him spending large amounts on food , time and supplements that he could work with the poor or preach... that being said would he judge you as gluttenous... well the 7 deadly sin were not from Jesus (AFAIK)

So bring jesus into the mordern age would disapprove of a bodybuilding lifestyle.. to be honest I don't know

s a little off subject, but a few weeks ago I heard some exclaim in shock "Jesus Christ on a 4 man bob sled" this painted such an interested picture I of course laughed... so was that taken the lords name in vien? picture the savor as a fun loving guy going down a mountian with a couple of buds.... well no IMHO ...however if ment in a bad light it was

and this is where I find my answer ,.to your questions... the decision that something is bad or not christian lies in your decision that it in not respectful of Jesus himself .. so if you feel that your bb activity is interfering with your relation with God then it is , if you feel it brings you closer then it is ok.

I remember hearing Branch Warren saying Jesus was his savor.. so why not ...

[Orange24]

It's absolutely a sin. After going to a Christian highschool and being a big stoner and fully tattoed I've gone over this a lot. I'm not the type of Christian that would judge one for their choices as I believe everyone's relationship w God is different but lots of Christians will disagree w me. We are altering our god given genetics w science. Almost playing god in a way. Many of us myself included do it for looks what it called being vain?


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I see where your coming from but I think the only sinful part of it is not obeying the laws or the land. Altering your appearance isn't necessarily a sin to me, or playing God. Just like putting make up on for a girl isn't necessarily a sin either.

I enjoy this life style, It doesn't take over my life but only makes it more enjoyable and better.

I do need to ponder though if using illegal substances to alter your appearance is something to wrestle with though.

[Vicious 13]

I see where your coming from but I think the only sinful part of it is not obeying the laws or the land. Altering your appearance isn't necessarily a sin to me, or playing God. Just like putting make up on for a girl isn't necessarily a sin either.

I enjoy this life style, It doesn't take over my life but only makes it more enjoyable and better.

I do need to ponder though if using illegal substances to alter your appearance is something to wrestle with though.

How about a man putting make up on? How about a man ciutting off his god given parts and turning them into female parts. God made us in his image. Perfect


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[Vicious 13]

Just food for thought. I consider myself christian and believe I have a great relationship with god. These are just things I've been told. I've prayed about it and I feel good about the way I live my life. Also I think gods laws and mans are very different 😊


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[Orange24]

Totally agree

[MuscleAddiction]

Just food for thought. I consider myself christian and believe I have a great relationship with god. These are just things I've been told. I've prayed about it and I feel good about the way I live my life. Also I think gods laws and mans are very different 😊


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I agree with you here Vic, as these are just some of the questions that have surfaced in my mind recently...maybe over thinking it. I am on my way to church right now for a class, but will come back to this discussion later...thanks brothers!!!

[MuscleAddiction]

I also do agree with Vic as we are genetically altering our bodies beyond what they were created to be...hence building freakishly large physiques through supplementation, and yes it is vain...just my opinion. We will continue this discssion later.

[Orange24]

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/02/11/826314f784d5727afb24b7b3333a0ef6.jpg


7k people at the alter last night! Pretty awesome!

[baby1]

I was baptized and raised Lutheran and attended a catholic High School. I tend to stay away from the newer age type of religions and when it comes down to things. As far as the bodybuilding lifestyle with or without "supplements" is not going to change god's love for you. Have to go with how you feel though and it is sort of like thinking you may never sin again as long as you will live. I have found some more contemporary Christian type churches to have some of the most judge mental people I have met, not all people of course though.

[JRam]

i do not believe these pursuits are generally antithetical to the Christian faith.

First, with respect to the illegality. The laws that prohibit some of the compounds that some may use, are not, in many instances, rational. On the one hand, you can "abort" a nine month old fetus in most states, yet the use by informed adults of certain relatively harmless compounds is prohibited. Similarly, alcohol, which has caused a great deal of heartache in this world, is freely available to all adults. While the Bible does encourage Christians to comply with the law of the land I don't think it necessarily requires blind fealty to unjust laws.

As for the use of these compounds, it is really not that different from any of the other medications that have been formulated throughout history IMO. Why would some be okay, but others not? One could say that it is strictly for vanity purposes but I think an argument can be made that it goes way beyond that in that the lifestyle provides a general sense of well-being that Jesus would want for his followers.

[baby1]

[QUOTE=Orange24;89492]http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/02/11/826314f784d5727afb24b7b3333a0ef6.jpg



7k people at the alter last night! Pretty awesome![/QUOTE


is that supposed to be church?

[Orange24]

[QUOTE=Orange24;89492]http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/02/11/826314f784d5727afb24b7b3333a0ef6.jpg



7k people at the alter last night! Pretty awesome![/QUOTE


is that supposed to be church?

Ya its a church conference.

[Orange24]

I was baptized and raised Lutheran and attended a catholic High School. I tend to stay away from the newer age type of religions and when it comes down to things. As far as the bodybuilding lifestyle with or without "supplements" is not going to change god's love for you. Have to go with how you feel though and it is sort of like thinking you may never sin again as long as you will live. I have found some more contemporary Christian type churches to have some of the most judge mental people I have met, not all people of course though.

People being judgemental whether Christian or not doesn't and shouldn't effect anyone but the person judging. I could care less what people think about me because I know who I am. My identity is secure and someone gossiping about whatever they think isn't spiritually or morally on point just goes in one ear and out the other.


You are 100% on point though, nothing can separate you from the Love of God

[MuscleAddiction]

Great discussion and thank you! Baby & Jram have very good points.

[Vicious 13]

I feel like if we didn't care what people think a lot of us wouldn't be doing this. I can say I'm doing it to feel good or whatever but then I'm lying to myself. I do it to look good which in turn makes me feel good. But all the time I spend looking in the mirror is vain and ungodly


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[baby1]

I am at the point in my life where I do not give a damn what people think about me, and it feels GREAT.

MA , I know you are just looking for feedback but go with your gut and how "you" feel.

[baby1]

[QUOTE=baby1;89497]

Ya its a church conference.

I thought it was a concert,lol. I know many people enjoy churches of this sort and that is awesome, but I guess I am still old school with that to. I still want to go to the old fashioned traditional church.

[Encino_Mang]

I don't think it goes against any Christian beliefs.

[Orange24]

[QUOTE=Orange24;89498]

I thought it was a concert,lol. I know many people enjoy churches of this sort and that is awesome, but I guess I am still old school with that to. I still want to go to the old fashioned traditional church.

I hear you. This was a few churches that are all connected getting together for a weekend. Some great speakers.

[lancer55]

I had plausible deniability before, now I am questioning this myself. I have an addictive personality, used to binge drink throughout the week. If it was not an addiction to the gym it would be an addiction to something unhealthy. Guess I do not need AAS for the gym so that was just me trying to justify it.

[Big Hoss]

First I want to say how much I appreciate and commend each and every one of you to come forward like this... it takes guts & courage to call yourself a "Christian" nowadays and I think we should give all glory, honor, & praise to God for giving us the strength to do so. Second, I think MA & Vic hit the nail on the head pertaining to this topic. I would like to share my thoughts as well because of being a born-again Christian for over 35 years now; this is something I struggle with on a daily basis and I can understand both sides of the fence so to speak.
You see Big Ronnie Coleman as a guest poser at a local BB show and you know from reliable sources that he is jacked to the hilt. He gets up onstage weighing well over 300 lbs. and hits some poses. He ends by him saying "I give all glory to God and I am a born-again Christian." So... I think to myself... I guess it's ok to use AAS/PED's because the Lord is blessing him and he is a winner. I get home and there it is... that nagging small voice in my head saying "Are you sure!?! Maybe you should read the Bible." And lo & behold, there it is, the whole entire book of Ecclesiastes.... "Everything Is Meaningless... Vanity, Vanity, all is Vanity."
So, to sum it up and to answer the question.... Anything that takes away the glory or takes the place of God and hinders your fellowship with Him is sinful. That could be AAS/PED's, other drugs, alcohol, smoking, playing a round of Sunday morning golf instead of being in Church, your kids' Sunday softball games, etc, etc., and the list goes on. On not on my soapbox here, I'm guilty of it too and yes I AM A HYPOCRITE!!! Pray that the Good Lord may bless us all with Godly wisdom to make better choices and judgments and find the right answers. Lastly, I'll close with this... RELIGION IS MAN'S ATTEMPT TO REACH GOD... CHRISTIANITY IS GOD'S ATTEMPT TO REACH MAN.

[Alec]

First I want to say how much I appreciate and commend each and every one of you to come forward like this... it takes guts & courage to call yourself a "Christian" nowadays and I think we should give all glory, honor, & praise to God for giving us the strength to do so. Second, I think MA & Vic hit the nail on the head pertaining to this topic. I would like to share my thoughts as well because of being a born-again Christian for over 35 years now; this is something I struggle with on a daily basis and I can understand both sides of the fence so to speak.
You see Big Ronnie Coleman as a guest poser at a local BB show and you know from reliable sources that he is jacked to the hilt. He gets up onstage weighing well over 300 lbs. and hits some poses. He ends by him saying "I give all glory to God and I am a born-again Christian." So... I think to myself... I guess it's ok to use AAS/PED's because the Lord is blessing him and he is a winner. I get home and there it is... that nagging small voice in my head saying "Are you sure!?! Maybe you should read the Bible." And lo & behold, there it is, the whole entire book of Ecclesiastes.... "Everything Is Meaningless... Vanity, Vanity, all is Vanity."
So, to sum it up and to answer the question.... Anything that takes away the glory or takes the place of God and hinders your fellowship with Him is sinful. That could be AAS/PED's, other drugs, alcohol, smoking, playing a round of Sunday morning golf instead of being in Church, your kids' Sunday softball games, etc, etc., and the list goes on. On not on my soapbox here, I'm guilty of it too and yes I AM A HYPOCRITE!!! Pray that the Good Lord may bless us all with Godly wisdom to make better choices and judgments and find the right answers. Lastly, I'll close with this... RELIGION IS MAN'S ATTEMPT TO REACH GOD... CHRISTIANITY IS GOD'S ATTEMPT TO REACH MAN.

Wow! That was powerful. I think you summed this up perfectly. This is a conviction He has placed on my heart heavily for the past couple of years. Surrendering my self-will is something that has always hindered my relationship with Him.
What should I do about it? If I was completely honest with myself, I don't think I'm ready to give up this lifestyle. I guess I need to pray about it.
God delivered me from a nasty heroin habit that cost me 4 years of my life behind bars. It was in prison that my faith was restored. I owe everything that I have accomplished to Him.
I honestly believe that no matter where we are in life God will show himself to us and give us guidance when we seek it. I'm just going to take it day by day and see what comes of it. It's refreshing to hear other men, from all over the country, struggling with the same conviction as me. We are not alone.


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[Orange24]

Holy Spirit is definitely speaking to all of us. Caution for sure

[Big Hoss]

Great to hear that brother! That's a powerful testimony in itself. Any addiction, bad-habit, obsession can be overcome thru the power of prayer, but like you said, we must seek God and WANT it! We must look to other fellow Christians for support, but like you, honestly, I don't know if I'm ready to give up that lifestyle. It's glad to see other Christians "coming out of the wood-work" though! :D

[Big Hoss]

Holy Spirit is definitely speaking to all of us. Caution for sure

Yep... that still small voice of conviction!

[Big Hoss]

I think the Good Lord led us all to the MC for a purpose!:)

[MuscleAddiction]

Thanks Hoss, and Alec you are not alone. Thank you Baby as you are always there for Nikki and I, and we love you. There is a song on the radio that has a verse "have an angel on my shoulder, and the devil in my head"...as my mind is my worst enemy at times. As far as my faith, well it has been renewed as of last year, so I look at it as if I am a novice in this, although like I said was baptized as a family last year...a very powerful day for our family as a whole, as well as for myself. I am reading the bible daily, as well as taking this day by day. I love this lifestyle of ours and no don't see myself turning away from it anytime soon...if ever. I am a man that has always lived my life doing the next right thing, I do not hurt anyone around me intentionally, I have been in two fist fights in my entire life back in high school, had a bout of drug use back then too, but ended it and picked up weights and this lifestyle to save me from further destruction in my life. I had a career that I was proud of (yes we should not be prideful), I have always worked hard to take care and support my family, always being the best father, husband, friend, brother, mentor, man I can be. I do not drink alcohol, I do not smoke...used to but gave it up, I do not cheat nor ever have, and love my wife and daughter with all my soul and being. I do carry resentments but working on them, I know they harm me more than they do others, there are some close relationships in my life that I can learn to be more forgiving and let go of those resentments...but working on them. When I was laid off my job of 23+ years it hit me hard, and as most will think that this really isn't much to be down and out about (yes I never wanted to talk or complain about MY problems to others because why were MY problems greater than other peoples, so kept them to myself and my close family...but am a man who wears his heart on his sleeve unfortunately). So when I decided it was time to give my life over to God and Christ as I had no control, and to work on my relationship with God and to surrender myself to his path for me, this is pretty much the only thing I see as a question to it all. Is it getting in the way of my relationship to him? I don't feel it is, I talk and pray to him daily, am active in our church, involved in a growth group at church, as well as volunteer in the youth program my daughter is in...I try and help as many in our community as I can, I love everyone, and I even have found myself swearing less lol...so I guess the sin I have through this lifestyle is vanity. I love the sport of bodybuilding, it saved my life from a road of destruction and has what I feel made me a better person, more confident, loving, caring, nurturing, compassionate, disciplined, hard working, and wanting to share and help others in this as well. Although it was a thought in me that has been lingering, as there are some aspects to it that can be looked upon as sin...but we are all sinners through Gods freewill, and Jesus died for our sins so we can be forgiven. Do I admit that I am sinning in the scheme of things sure, do I ask for forgiveness yes, do I pray daily yes, do I owe it all to God for what I have been blessed with in my life you bet, will I continue walking Gods path and help spread his love and word...YES. It is nice to see that I am not the only one here, I have put myself out there in a vulnerable state, but like Baby said earlier, I am at a time in my life that I do not care what people think of me, my judgment day will come, I do not judge others as I do not know what their journey is in their path of God, all I can do is the next right thing...and be the best I can...and love!!!

Thanks for letting me share, felt really good.

[Big Hoss]

Thanks Hoss, and Alec you are not alone. Thank you Baby as you are always there for Nikki and I, and we love you. There is a song on the radio that has a verse "have an angel on my shoulder, and the devil in my head"...as my mind is my worst enemy at times. As far as my faith, well it has been renewed as of last year, so I look at it as if I am a novice in this, although like I said was baptized as a family 12/16/14...a very powerful day for our family as a whole, as well as for myself. I am reading the bible daily, as well as taking this day by day. I love this lifestyle of ours and no don't see myself turning away from it anytime soon...if ever. I am a man that has always lived my life doing the next right thing, I do not hurt anyone around me intentionally, I have been in two fist fights in my entire life back in high school, had a bout of drug use back then too, but ended it and picked up weights and this lifestyle to save me from further destruction in my life. I had a career that I was proud of (yes we should not be prideful), I have always worked hard to take care and support my family, always being the best father, husband, friend, brother, mentor, man I can be. I do not drink alcohol, I do not smoke...used to but gave it up, I do not cheat nor ever have, and love my wife and daughter with all my soul and being. I do carry resentments but working on them, I know they harm me more than they do others, there are some close relationships in my life that I can learn to be more forgiving and let go of those resentments...but working on them. When I was laid off my job of 23+ years it hit me hard, and as most will think that this really isn't much to be down and out about (yes I never wanted to talk or complain about MY problems to others because why were MY problems greater than other peoples, so kept them to myself and my close family...but am a man who wears his heart on his sleeve unfortunately). So when I decided it was time to give my life over to God and Christ as I had no control, and to work on my relationship with God and to surrender myself to his path for me, this is pretty much the only thing I see as a question to it all. Is it getting in the way of my relationship to him? I don't feel it is, I talk and pray to him daily, am active in our church, involved in a growth group at church, as well as volunteer in the youth program my daughter is in...I try and help as many in our community as I can, I love everyone, and I even have found myself swearing less lol...so I guess the sin I have through this lifestyle is vanity. I love the sport of bodybuilding, it saved my life from a road of destruction and has what I feel made me a better person, more confident, loving, caring, nurturing, compassionate, disciplined, hard working, and wanting to share and help others in this as well. Although it was a thought in me that has been lingering, as there are some aspects to it that can be looked upon as sin...but we are all sinners through Gods freewill, and Jesus died for our sins so we can be forgiven. Do I admit that I am sinning in the scheme of things sure, do I ask for forgiveness yes, do I pray daily yes, do I owe it all to God for what I have been blessed with in my life you bet, will I continue walking Gods path and help spread his love and word...YES. It is nice to see that I am not the only one here, I have put myself out there in a vulnerable state, but like Baby said earlier, I am at a time in my life that I do not care what people think of me, my judgment day will come, I do not judge others as I do not know what their journey is in their path of God, all I can do is the next right thing...and be the best I can...and love!!!

Thanks for letting me share, felt really good.

Well put MA. Like you I just love lifting weights. The iron has kept my OCD & manic depression at bay and has taught me discipline & self-control (except at times of you-know-when) and at the gym where I train I have met some stand-up bro's. It's a real challenge and struggle to give up ALL aspects of it. May God bless us all thru these trials and tribulations.

[MuscleAddiction]

Well put MA. Like you I just love lifting weights. The iron has kept my OCD & manic depression at bay and has taught me discipline & self-control (except at times of you-know-when) and at the gym where I train I have met some stand-up bro's. It's a real challenge and struggle to give up ALL aspects of it. May God bless us all thru these trials and tribulations.

Amen!!! God bless us all!!!

[Big Hoss]

Here's some good websites & reading material that has helped me throughout the years on my Christian walk...

thebereancall.org (The Berean Call - Books & Newsletter)
Henry Morris Study Bible (King James Version)
icr.org (The Institute for Creation Research - Books & Newsletter)
"My Hero Walks on Water" - by Brian Dobson (Trainer to Ronnie Coleman, Branch Warren, and others)

[knights]

Sinners, believers, have faith, don't have faith, atheist.........we will ALL be judged. HE will judge us by what HE has tasked us too. HE will only judge us by what obstacles and challenges HE has placed in front of us.

I may never go to heaven even having lived a life with faith, devotion and righteousness because I may someway somehow have FAILED at what HE placed in front of ME.

God has given all of us different reasons for being here, he has given all of us different tasks, even the worst of the worst may still have a place besides HIM if they pass HIS tests.

The only thing we can do is to live our lifes, face our challenges and do unto others as we would wish they do unto us.

[Ironguruera]

I'm not a Christian but I enjoyed the thread and it's a very interesting debate you are all having here!

[Orange24]

I'm not a Christian but I enjoyed the thread and it's a very interesting debate you are all having here!

I respect everyone's beliefs. What do you believe in exactly?

[baby1]

I believe but one thing I do not do is preach my beliefs on others. We have some reborn Christians in the family and we cannot get together with them without them shoving their beliefs down our throat,. Now it has been their saving grace and I am very happy for them so that is good. What I want to know is what does "reborn Christtan" really mean? Like I said I was baptized and raised Lutheran which is a Christian religion but wonder how it differs from reborn?

[MuscleAddiction]

Wasn't trying to sound preachy, even my mother-in-law made a comment about me being a reborn Christian, kind of hurt, but for me it is just coming back to maturing in my spiritual growth which never really had much attention in my life until now.

[Big Hoss]

A re-dedication of faith.

[xdude]

Wasn't trying to sound preachy, even my mother-in-law made a comment about me being a reborn Christian, kind of hurt, but for me it is just coming back to maturing in my spiritual growth which never really had much attention in my life until now.

your mother in law made a crack? that is just wrong..
I mean the one thing we know about religeon is that no one has proof they have the right answer....

SO great she is judging ..

were you being prechy ...or just saying this is what I have been doing..?

[baby1]

MA, I don't think you came off that way at all. I to have become a very spiritual person and more so in the past year but for me it is completely different from my faith. Just a feeling that is hard to explain but it is a great one. Do what it is that makes you feel good.

[MuscleAddiction]

your mother in law made a crack? that is just wrong..
I mean the one thing we know about religeon is that no one has proof they have the right answer....

SO great she is judging ..

were you being prechy ...or just saying this is what I have been doing..?

Well, yes she did...maybe not intentional but yeah, Nikki was letting her know during a phone call how involved I have become with our church, reading the bible daily, bible study, youth group leader, and just working on my spiritual maturity, and she made the comment "these born again Christians", and she has been the one to be going to church all these years, always reminding me to be forgiving, loving, and that God loves unconditionally (when it comes to my oldest daughter situation over the years) but then tells my wife she does not believe in heaven...interesting. I love her, but has not sat right with me. Anyway, not judging, was just taken back a bit.

[MuscleAddiction]

MA, I don't think you came off that way at all. I to have become a very spiritual person and more so in the past year but for me it is completely different from my faith. Just a feeling that is hard to explain but it is a great one. Do what it is that makes you feel good.

Just checking Baby, again new to it and yes don't want to be or sound preachy, just trying to explain where I am at. I am reading a really good book right now called "Embraced By The Light" by Betty J. Eadie, a book of her near death experience, really good and worth reading. There was a part in it that hit home with me hard...

"I saw the evil in surrendering to one of Satan's greatest tools...my personal cycles of guilt and fear. I understood I had to let go of the past. If I had broken laws or sinned, I needed to change my heart, forgive myself, and then move onward. If I had hurt someone, I needed to start loving them honestly and seek their forgiveness. If I had damaged my own spirit, I needed to approach God and feel his love again, his healing love."

That is where I am at in my life, I have love of my wife, daughter, friends, and family...but still missing something...that is where I am at with my relationship with God.

[Big Hoss]

Christians have been persecuted, hated, ridiculed, mocked, scoffed, etc., etc. for centuries by our own friends, family, peers, government, and the list goes on. It's how you handle the situation is what separates us from the world. We are instructed to pray for those who hurt us and to pray for our enemies. It is very hard to do at times; believe me, it has happened to me throughout my 35+ years of being a Christian, and it deeply hurts, so you are not alone. Your natural instinct is to "get back" at the ones who hurt us, but to practice self-control and ask God for strength and Godly wisdom is half the battle in itself. If we pray for those people, God will take care of the rest, it just takes patience on our part.

[Vicious 13]

That's a two way straight. Christians persecute and some are the most judgmental people I've ever met 😃


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[baby1]

That's a two way straight. Christians persecute and some are the most judgmental people I've ever met ��


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This is what I had stated earlier. I have come across some "Christians" that if you were not a part of their church than you were looked down on. Some have even extended their help to "Church family" before blood relatives because they were not part of the church.

[Nbencze]

Ahh......I'm a new found christian, and I'm struggling with this one. I think I'm a man and I'm going to sin. One thing I've learned from bible study is that a sin is a sin. So I don't see what I do as any worse than cussing, or talking about someone else.

[Big Hoss]

Recently found this website... samsonwear.com. The guy has a great personal testimony.

[johnsomebody]

Thanks Hoss, and Alec you are not alone. Thank you Baby as you are always there for Nikki and I, and we love you. There is a song on the radio that has a verse "have an angel on my shoulder, and the devil in my head"...as my mind is my worst enemy at times. As far as my faith, well it has been renewed as of last year, so I look at it as if I am a novice in this, although like I said was baptized as a family last year...a very powerful day for our family as a whole, as well as for myself. I am reading the bible daily, as well as taking this day by day. I love this lifestyle of ours and no don't see myself turning away from it anytime soon...if ever. I am a man that has always lived my life doing the next right thing, I do not hurt anyone around me intentionally, I have been in two fist fights in my entire life back in high school, had a bout of drug use back then too, but ended it and picked up weights and this lifestyle to save me from further destruction in my life. I had a career that I was proud of (yes we should not be prideful), I have always worked hard to take care and support my family, always being the best father, husband, friend, brother, mentor, man I can be. I do not drink alcohol, I do not smoke...used to but gave it up, I do not cheat nor ever have, and love my wife and daughter with all my soul and being. I do carry resentments but working on them, I know they harm me more than they do others, there are some close relationships in my life that I can learn to be more forgiving and let go of those resentments...but working on them. When I was laid off my job of 23+ years it hit me hard, and as most will think that this really isn't much to be down and out about (yes I never wanted to talk or complain about MY problems to others because why were MY problems greater than other peoples, so kept them to myself and my close family...but am a man who wears his heart on his sleeve unfortunately). So when I decided it was time to give my life over to God and Christ as I had no control, and to work on my relationship with God and to surrender myself to his path for me, this is pretty much the only thing I see as a question to it all. Is it getting in the way of my relationship to him? I don't feel it is, I talk and pray to him daily, am active in our church, involved in a growth group at church, as well as volunteer in the youth program my daughter is in...I try and help as many in our community as I can, I love everyone, and I even have found myself swearing less lol...so I guess the sin I have through this lifestyle is vanity. I love the sport of bodybuilding, it saved my life from a road of destruction and has what I feel made me a better person, more confident, loving, caring, nurturing, compassionate, disciplined, hard working, and wanting to share and help others in this as well. Although it was a thought in me that has been lingering, as there are some aspects to it that can be looked upon as sin...but we are all sinners through Gods freewill, and Jesus died for our sins so we can be forgiven. Do I admit that I am sinning in the scheme of things sure, do I ask for forgiveness yes, do I pray daily yes, do I owe it all to God for what I have been blessed with in my life you bet, will I continue walking Gods path and help spread his love and word...YES. It is nice to see that I am not the only one here, I have put myself out there in a vulnerable state, but like Baby said earlier, I am at a time in my life that I do not care what people think of me, my judgment day will come, I do not judge others as I do not know what their journey is in their path of God, all I can do is the next right thing...and be the best I can...and love!!!

Thanks for letting me share, felt really good.

Wow, this is really a great heartfelt and honest post, and you express yourself very well. I'm really glad I came across it.

Plus I understand your uncertainty about this issue, since I've dealt with the similar issues for decades as a Christian. But it's not been about gear (which I've only used a few times) but about pretty much EVERYTHING. And I realize that that's just part of following Christ –not having the perfect answer for "is this right or is this wrong" for ALL the things that one encounters in life. But believing in Christ means having him as "Lord", which means that he has the final say, and that's between him and me personally. He's the one I want to listen to as to if something is good or bad, right or wrong, go this way or that way, and everyone else can take a flying leap. Not that I don't appreciate advice at times, but what is "sin" or not is decided by him, not someone else.

Here's what helps me with an issue like gear, where Jesus spells it out, it seems to me, very clearly: Jesus' own words from Mark ch7...

"Nothing outside a person can defile them by going into them. Rather, it is what comes out of a person that defiles them.”
He went on: “What comes out of a person is what defiles them.
For it is from within, out of a person’s heart, that evil thoughts come—sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, malice, deceit, lewdness, envy, slander, arrogance and folly.
All these evils come from inside and defile a person.”

And "defile" means "to separate from God by making a person 'unclean'".

So think about it: Jesus, it seems to me, is making it very clear that gear or whatever going into a person cannot possibly cut that person off from God. It's what's in one's heart, not whatever chemicals may or may not be in one's body, that threaten one's standing with God.

The only "threat" I see from the whole bodybuilding "lifestyle" is it can mean obsessing too much about externals while ignoring the envy, hate, greed, arrogance (to name a few from Christ's list) in one's own heart.
But it's hardly bodybuilders alone who do that.

[Orange24]

Good point

[Big Hoss]

Wow, this is really a great heartfelt and honest post, and you express yourself very well. I'm really glad I came across it.

Plus I understand your uncertainty about this issue, since I've dealt with the similar issues for decades as a Christian. But it's not been about gear (which I've only used a few times) but about pretty much EVERYTHING. And I realize that that's just part of following Christ –not having the perfect answer for "is this right or is this wrong" for ALL the things that one encounters in life. But believing in Christ means having him as "Lord", which means that he has the final say, and that's between him and me personally. He's the one I want to listen to as to if something is good or bad, right or wrong, go this way or that way, and everyone else can take a flying leap. Not that I don't appreciate advice at times, but what is "sin" or not is decided by him, not someone else.

Here's what helps me with an issue like gear, where Jesus spells it out, it seems to me, very clearly: Jesus' own words from Mark ch7...

"Nothing outside a person can defile them by going into them. Rather, it is what comes out of a person that defiles them.”
He went on: “What comes out of a person is what defiles them.
For it is from within, out of a person’s heart, that evil thoughts come—sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, malice, deceit, lewdness, envy, slander, arrogance and folly.
All these evils come from inside and defile a person.”

And "defile" means "to separate from God by making a person 'unclean'".

So think about it: Jesus, it seems to me, is making it very clear that gear or whatever going into a person cannot possibly cut that person off from God. It's what's in one's heart, not whatever chemicals may or may not be in one's body, that threaten one's standing with God.

The only "threat" I see from the whole bodybuilding "lifestyle" is it can mean obsessing too much about externals while ignoring the envy, hate, greed, arrogance (to name a few from Christ's list) in one's own heart.
But it's hardly bodybuilders alone who do that.

Great post. I appreciate your thoughts. I'm just glad to see more and more 'brethren' posting on here. That takes courage in itself!

[baby1]

Great post. I appreciate your thoughts. I'm just glad to see more and more 'brethren' posting on here. That takes courage in itself!


DITTO!

[MuscleAddiction]

Wow, this is really a great heartfelt and honest post, and you express yourself very well. I'm really glad I came across it.

Plus I understand your uncertainty about this issue, since I've dealt with the similar issues for decades as a Christian. But it's not been about gear (which I've only used a few times) but about pretty much EVERYTHING. And I realize that that's just part of following Christ –not having the perfect answer for "is this right or is this wrong" for ALL the things that one encounters in life. But believing in Christ means having him as "Lord", which means that he has the final say, and that's between him and me personally. He's the one I want to listen to as to if something is good or bad, right or wrong, go this way or that way, and everyone else can take a flying leap. Not that I don't appreciate advice at times, but what is "sin" or not is decided by him, not someone else.

Here's what helps me with an issue like gear, where Jesus spells it out, it seems to me, very clearly: Jesus' own words from Mark ch7...

"Nothing outside a person can defile them by going into them. Rather, it is what comes out of a person that defiles them.”
He went on: “What comes out of a person is what defiles them.
For it is from within, out of a person’s heart, that evil thoughts come—sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, malice, deceit, lewdness, envy, slander, arrogance and folly.
All these evils come from inside and defile a person.”

And "defile" means "to separate from God by making a person 'unclean'".

So think about it: Jesus, it seems to me, is making it very clear that gear or whatever going into a person cannot possibly cut that person off from God. It's what's in one's heart, not whatever chemicals may or may not be in one's body, that threaten one's standing with God.

The only "threat" I see from the whole bodybuilding "lifestyle" is it can mean obsessing too much about externals while ignoring the envy, hate, greed, arrogance (to name a few from Christ's list) in one's own heart.
But it's hardly bodybuilders alone who do that.

Thank you for the insight brother! Excellent!!

[MuscleAddiction]

Great post. I appreciate your thoughts. I'm just glad to see more and more 'brethren' posting on here. That takes courage in itself!

Ditto x2!!!

[bonis90]

dude you injecting yourself with stuff that will shorten your life , getting all greased up and flexing in less than you where for underwear...

that aint going to church

:cool:

[Vicious 13]

I agree w bonis. The above argument is saying go ahead and put whatever drugs u want in your body as long as u have a good heart. IMO if god wanted is to b born big muscle bound guys we would have. God gave is our genetics we are made in his image. However he also gave us choice and free will. We choose to enhance our god given bodies. Addiction is a sin. Whether it be muscle weights beer drugs sex whatever. Can we b forgiven absolutely but don't try and justify sin god ain't no fool. B true to him and yourself repent ask for forgiveness. Pray going around looking for loop holes in the bible doesn't really work


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[johnsomebody]

I agree w bonis. The above argument is saying go ahead and put whatever drugs u want in your body as long as u have a good heart. IMO if god wanted is to b born big muscle bound guys we would have. God gave is our genetics we are made in his image. However he also gave us choice and free will. We choose to enhance our god given bodies. Addiction is a sin. Whether it be muscle weights beer drugs sex whatever. Can we b forgiven absolutely but don't try and justify sin god ain't no fool. B true to him and yourself repent ask for forgiveness. Pray going around looking for loop holes in the bible doesn't really work


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Let me comment on this too, since it's an important issue for any Christian, whether using gear or not.

The context in Mark 7 is about eating "unclean" foods like pork, which made the person who ate it unclean and separated from God according to the Law of Moses; it was clearly a sin. Christ rejects that totally and very clearly when he decreed: "Nothing outside a person can defile them by going into them."

Is pork bad for you? Maybe it is, and certainly too much of it is, like too much of about anything else for that matter. But that doesn't make eating it a sin to Christ, and if you're a Christian what Christ says is what matters, not anyone else's opinion.

Smoking directly damages the health of anyone who uses it, beginning with the first puff. Is smoking a sin? Of course not; smoking can't separate anyone from the love of God that's in Christ any more than pork or gear can.

This is where "the freedom that is in Christ" which Paul discusses comes in. "Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is helpful. Everything is permissible for me, but I will not allow anything to control me." In my experience, knowing that I don't have to worry that this or that thing like gear or smoking is a "sin" means I can look at that thing objectively: is it helpful for me or others or is it harmful to me or others? Am I choosing it freely or am I addicted to it?

As to whether one should be content with one's self as is, that's a choice one makes for one's self. Personally, I've learned that being sick and starving in a dungeon somewhere and being genuinely thankful to God for, say, a crust of bread, means I'm a happier person than Jay Cutler worrying about whether or not his calves are big enough and never taking a moment to thank God for anything.

[Encino_Mang]

Let me comment on this too, since it's an important issue for any Christian, whether using gear or not.

The context in Mark 7 is about eating "unclean" foods like pork, which made the person who ate it unclean and separated from God according to the Law of Moses; it was clearly a sin. Christ rejects that totally and very clearly when he decreed: "Nothing outside a person can defile them by going into them."

Is pork bad for you? Maybe it is, and certainly too much of it is, like too much of about anything else for that matter. But that doesn't make eating it a sin to Christ, and if you're a Christian what Christ says is what matters, not anyone else's opinion.

Smoking directly damages the health of anyone who uses it, beginning with the first puff. Is smoking a sin? Of course not; smoking can't separate anyone from the love of God that's in Christ any more than pork or gear can.

This is where "the freedom that is in Christ" which Paul discusses comes in. "Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is helpful. Everything is permissible for me, but I will not allow anything to control me." In my experience, knowing that I don't have to worry that this or that thing like gear or smoking is a "sin" means I can look at that thing objectively: is it helpful for me or others or is it harmful to me or others? Am I choosing it freely or am I addicted to it?

As to whether one should be content with one's self as is, that's a choice one makes for one's self. Personally, I've learned that being sick and starving in a dungeon somewhere and being genuinely thankful to God for, say, a crust of bread, means I'm a happier person than Jay Cutler worrying about whether or not his calves are big enough and never taking a moment to thank God for anything.

I like this post!

[bonis90]

dude you injecting yourself with stuff that will shorten your life , getting all greased up and flexing in less than you where for underwear...

that aint going to church

:cool:

wait ,,,, I am not to be taken seriously....:D
I actually wondered why we got dressed up for church... after all god see us all naked and still loves us
that is amazing in some cases..

anyhow ...
that all being said ... my point it that injecting crap in you does seem to me violating the spirit of the religion

I once had a co worker that was 7th day adventist ...and his particular group believe firmly in a small passage of the bible
something about grains nuts and berries and as part of his faith believed in being Vegan...
( he was 6'2 and about 140 lbs and could pound down a bag of apples in one day along with a boat load of pasta and cake at lunch)
it was impressive how much he ate, but nothing that would stick to your ribs... but that was his belief system
I also thought it was strange that he didn't eat fish .... after all it was the miracle of loaves and fishes.. not just loaves
So if Jesus was going to make a comment of vegan eating I would think it would show up then right?
I did give him something to think about with that question...
then I really kind of felt sorry ...after all I was not much of a believer and here I am shaking this guy's faith.
I am not a hater ... just don't push it on me ...and he wasn't ..I was curious

Hispanics in my area place a sticker on their head lamps with an outline of Jesus,,, I thought would Jesus want that ...and since he was god I came to the conclusion that if you are honestly meaning it in a good light... then he would be ok with it ...

again I am left with ,if you feel that Bodybuilding lifestyle is in line your with beliefs and you are honest about it ..then Jesus would be OK with it

given the extremes of people beliefs ( vegan, those people that whip themselves .the ones that sign up for a cruifixtion, extreme lent people ...those opis dei crazy, diamond dallas page and wrestling for Jesus, just to name a few ) is injecting crap into you and flexing in your underwear really that far out ..

if you honestly believe this is what jesus wants you to do...then I am good with it
again just don't push it on me

and please don't take me serious ever again

[Big Hoss]

Still stickin' with my answer of "YES". Here's some support scripture...

Ecclesiastes Ch. 2
Romans Ch. 13
1 Peter 2: 13-17
1 Corinthians 6: 19-20
1 Timothy 4: 8

I can research and find more, but this is what comes to mind right now...

[Layddually2]

I see where your coming from but I think the only sinful part of it is not obeying the laws or the land. Altering your appearance isn't necessarily a sin to me, or playing God. Just like putting make up on for a girl isn't necessarily a sin either.

I enjoy this life style, It doesn't take over my life but only makes it more enjoyable and better.

I do need to ponder though if using illegal substances to alter your appearance is something to wrestle with though.

The laws we are not "obeying" are human laws put in place by people that try to control us. Those laws don't count. Now this is how I see it yes it is a sin unless you are using it to spread the word of god, spending just as much time help the poor, sick or elderly. Now the act of bodybuilding it's self is not a sin unless it consumes you or your time that could be spent helping others. God created us in his image, of course he is jacked. Ok that was probably not funny. I help people and tell people about god every chance I get in hopes that it will balance out all my sins from the past.

The main thing about this lifestyle is it can be selfish, ego driven, and can consume you.

[Layddually2]

MA you support your family by being jacked correct? That makes it your job. That isn't a selfish act.

[Orange24]

The laws we are not "obeying" are human laws put in place by people that try to control us. Those laws don't count. Now this is how I see it yes it is a sin unless you are using it to spread the word of god, spending just as much time help the poor, sick or elderly. Now the act of bodybuilding it's self is not a sin unless it consumes you or your time that could be spent helping others. God created us in his image, of course he is jacked. Ok that was probably not funny. I help people and tell people about god every chance I get in hopes that it will balance out all my sins from the past.

The main thing about this lifestyle is it can be selfish, ego driven, and can consume you.

Layd I appreciate your honesty here man. I want to say though that telling people about God every chance you get doesnt "balance" out your sin from the past". The truth is that gods that good bro, you can't ever earn it, you can't ever do enough good things for people or for your family where God says "alright, it's equal now". Humans play the "pay me back" game but that isn't what Jesus did. You owe him nothing, you now just get to have a free relationship with him. And he gives you two very very simple instructions that are super difficult when fully manifested and that's Love your God and love your neighbor, and lest we ever forget, enemies are still neighbors.

In life whenever somebody does something nice for us, takes us to dinner, pays for our meal, shows up with an unexpected gift, etc... It's our innate nature to want to do something nice back for them in return. That's to keep the balance of the relationship healthy. Giving and expecting in return isn't love, trust me it's not, but the nature of having that inclination to do something in return for those that have helped us really is the "payback" so that it's not all on them giving and you receiving. Jesus doesn't give to you and hope you balance out the relationship, he just keeps giving and giving and giving and giving, and eventually God decided we're gonna give something real big, my son. And that my friend, can never be paid. Serve your heart out for your friends and family, serve your neighborhood, your business, your friends and your enemies.

Scripture says the son of man came not to be served, but to serve. So, serving saved the world. If we think that we can earn it back, then it negates the Gift. A gift is a gift, because it's a gift.

[Layddually2]

Thank you orange. I just saying in my personal life I feel I owe a lot. Even if I don't I feel I do.

[MuscleAddiction]

Layd I appreciate your honesty here man. I want to say though that telling people about God every chance you get doesnt "balance" out your sin from the past". The truth is that gods that good bro, you can't ever earn it, you can't ever do enough good things for people or for your family where God says "alright, it's equal now". Humans play the "pay me back" game but that isn't what Jesus did. You owe him nothing, you now just get to have a free relationship with him. And he gives you two very very simple instructions that are super difficult when fully manifested and that's Love your God and love your neighbor, and lest we ever forget, enemies are still neighbors.

In life whenever somebody does something nice for us, takes us to dinner, pays for our meal, shows up with an unexpected gift, etc... It's our innate nature to want to do something nice back for them in return. That's to keep the balance of the relationship healthy. Giving and expecting in return isn't love, trust me it's not, but the nature of having that inclination to do something in return for those that have helped us really is the "payback" so that it's not all on them giving and you receiving. Jesus doesn't give to you and hope you balance out the relationship, he just keeps giving and giving and giving and giving, and eventually God decided we're gonna give something real big, my son. And that my friend, can never be paid. Serve your heart out for your friends and family, serve your neighborhood, your business, your friends and your enemies.

Scripture says the son of man came not to be served, but to serve. So, serving saved the world. If we think that we can earn it back, then it negates the Gift. A gift is a gift, because it's a gift.

Beautiful Orange, and is what I have been learning. We are studying Isaiah in bible study right now, it will probably take the rest of the year for us as a men's group to get through it, but the beautiful thing about it is there is a life lesson in every scripture, there is a lesson that I can learn from in that specific weeks readings, and trust me as I am an infant born again here just learning to crawl, but I am. Listening to all of you here has been such a true blessing to me, ALL of you, like our own newfound brotherhood here that we can grow together in, and that is what I am really looking for. Yes Layd, it seems that God has me on a path right now doing what I love, this lifestyle and helping others. Something came to me as a sign this past week, so went for an interview for a position I thought was the PERFECT position for me as it was what I was doing for the last 10 years of my career before I was laid off in 2013 (23 years total), put my best foot forward, had a portfolio with a dozen letters of recommendation, credentials, certifications, very qualified on paper and experience...but did not get offered another interview (2nd) as I did not score high enough. Noe let me give some more background, I know all these managers and peers from working at my last job as the cities worked together with all kinds of training, mutual aid, contract work, and I know all of them very well, even the Superintendent asked me to apply, but I said from the beginning to my wife "if it is Gods will, it will be", so when the disappointing news came in an email, she looked at me and said "remember you said Gods will, well it wasn't" and as it still stung because I regressed back to how I was before and how I handled disappointments, I got over it quicker.

Then this past Sunday as I was walking into church my pastor pulled me aside as I was walking in and had a favor/question for me. Knowing we just built our gym in our garage to train people, and him knowing that I am looking to help others in this lifestyle as well as others in health and fitness, he asked if I would mentor a teenage boy who has lost his way...an athlete in school who has fallen in with the wrong crowd, but is still a part of our church, and then says well there actually may be a couple more that need a mentor and coach and if I would be interested in training him and talking to him, and I said yes of course with a huge smile on my face...this is what I wanted to do, help teens and kids as well adopt a healthy lifestyle in health, fitness, and nutrition. So Nikki had mentioned to me after..."see, if you were to have been offered a job where you would have to work 5 days a week, possible overtime, and basically on-call 24/7, would you have been able to do Gods work, or would he have been able to work through you?"
These are the signs of confirmations I get from God, and as he is still rebuilding me and testing my faith for him and Jesus Christ, and I am still working on my shortcomings, resentments, bitterness towards some who have hurt me, and working on forgiveness...I love all, but some I just have a hard time forgiving. Working my spiritual steps "Celebrate Recovery", and living day by day in Gods will, drawing strength from him and Christ, prayer, and keeping faith that he has me right where he wants me at this moment.
I have read every post in this thread and appreciate all input and insight, love to you all, and this is why I wanted to have this forum and topic, to see how many else are walking with us.

[Big Hoss]

"The Lord works in mysterious ways!" :)

[Layddually2]

God is leading you MA!


Beautiful Orange, and is what I have been learning. We are studying Isaiah in bible study right now, it will probably take the rest of the year for us as a men's group to get through it, but the beautiful thing about it is there is a life lesson in every scripture, there is a lesson that I can learn from in that specific weeks readings, and trust me as I am an infant born again here just learning to crawl, but I am. Listening to all of you here has been such a true blessing to me, ALL of you, like our own newfound brotherhood here that we can grow together in, and that is what I am really looking for. Yes Layd, it seems that God has me on a path right now doing what I love, this lifestyle and helping others. Something came to me as a sign this past week, so went for an interview for a position I thought was the PERFECT position for me as it was what I was doing for the last 10 years of my career before I was laid off in 2013 (23 years total), put my best foot forward, had a portfolio with a dozen letters of recommendation, credentials, certifications, very qualified on paper and experience...but did not get offered another interview (2nd) as I did not score high enough. Noe let me give some more background, I know all these managers and peers from working at my last job as the cities worked together with all kinds of training, mutual aid, contract work, and I know all of them very well, even the Superintendent asked me to apply, but I said from the beginning to my wife "if it is Gods will, it will be", so when the disappointing news came in an email, she looked at me and said "remember you said Gods will, well it wasn't" and as it still stung because I regressed back to how I was before and how I handled disappointments, I got over it quicker.

Then this past Sunday as I was walking into church my pastor pulled me aside as I was walking in and had a favor/question for me. Knowing we just built our gym in our garage to train people, and him knowing that I am looking to help others in this lifestyle as well as others in health and fitness, he asked if I would mentor a teenage boy who has lost his way...an athlete in school who has fallen in with the wrong crowd, but is still a part of our church, and then says well there actually may be a couple more that need a mentor and coach and if I would be interested in training him and talking to him, and I said yes of course with a huge smile on my face...this is what I wanted to do, help teens and kids as well adopt a healthy lifestyle in health, fitness, and nutrition. So Nikki had mentioned to me after..."see, if you were to have been offered a job where you would have to work 5 days a week, possible overtime, and basically on-call 24/7, would you have been able to do Gods work, or would he have been able to work through you?"
These are the signs of confirmations I get from God, and as he is still rebuilding me and testing my faith for him and Jesus Christ, and I am still working on my shortcomings, resentments, bitterness towards some who have hurt me, and working on forgiveness...I love all, but some I just have a hard time forgiving. Working my spiritual steps "Celebrate Recovery", and living day by day in Gods will, drawing strength from him and Christ, prayer, and keeping faith that he has me right where he wants me at this moment.
I have read every post in this thread and appreciate all input and insight, love to you all, and this is why I wanted to have this forum and topic, to see how many else are walking with us.

[MuscleAddiction]

God is leading you MA!

:) yeah he is, and I will follow eager to learn and build our relationship stronger. I have no control, thought I did...then it was stripped from me, humbling experience and very humiliating, but I am good with it, we have what we need, we are not starving, we have shelter, clothes, education for our little girl, a nurturing community and church family, ability to live, laugh, and love, do what we are passionate about, and be together more everyday as a family, that there is wealth and success in my heart.

And of course our family here too!

[Orange24]

:) yeah he is, and I will follow eager to learn and build our relationship stronger. I have no control, thought I did...then it was stripped from me, humbling experience and very humiliating, but I am good with it, we have what we need, we are not starving, we have shelter, clothes, education for our little girl, a nurturing community and church family, ability to live, laugh, and love, do what we are passionate about, and be together more everyday as a family, that there is wealth and success in my heart.

Great perspective. We lack nothing

[Big Hoss]

:) yeah he is, and I will follow eager to learn and build our relationship stronger. I have no control, thought I did...then it was stripped from me, humbling experience and very humiliating, but I am good with it, we have what we need, we are not starving, we have shelter, clothes, education for our little girl, a nurturing community and church family, ability to live, laugh, and love, do what we are passionate about, and be together more everyday as a family, that there is wealth and success in my heart.

And of course our family here too!

God always looks after his children! He may not always give us what we WANT, but he always meets our NEEDS! :o

[kazman68]

Wonderful idea this thread. Happy to see people not afraid to show their love for their creator, we are facing difficult times, so much going on in the world that is over the top.

[MuscleAddiction]

Wonderful idea this thread. Happy to see people not afraid to show their love for their creator, we are facing difficult times, so much going on in the world that is over the top.

Amen Kaz! Good to see you brother!